Chess Scotland Noticeboard

Daniel Rocks

Very preliminary. Due to some personal contacts I am able to secure a venue in Dunbartonshire for the first weekend in August at an extremely low price for a hall which can hold 200 people. Thinking of organising a tournament with the following system:

Format

1) 5 round tournament with 6 players in each section. Held over Saturday & Sunday only. Tournaments will be decided upon entry list and will run according to grading. So eg, 6 2000 players will play against each other in an all-play-all, 6 1700 play against each other. Effectively groups of all-play-alls. Certain sections could possibly be FIDE-rated? (need confirmation from our esteemed colleagues such as Mr Howie, Wilson or McFarlane).

2) Could have 4 player all-play-all groups which would mean 6 games and black and white vs each opponent. My initial feeling however is that 6 games (3 per day) may be too many?

Prize scheme.

After costs of venue etc, I think a fairest way is for the prizes to only slightly decrease as the sections go down. The supposed venue is 9 miles from Glasgow and is a 45 minute bus journey from Buchanan Street Bus station, buses run every 30 mins at weekends.

It would be an experimental tournament and I like the 6-player all-play-all format as it ensures that there can be no qualms about fairness and can ensure there will be no byes etc.

Reason I post on here is to gauge interest. If there is sufficient interest then I am prepared to put in the time to make this tournament a reality. Feedback etc would be much appreciated. Please post about views on format(s).

Also, venue has ample free parking and tables & chairs provided. Would need an arbiter and sets & pieces.

Regards.

(Edit message: Forgot to proof read when first posted, meant 6 players, not 5 ). Embarassed

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Daniel Rocks

SteveHilton · King Joined: 24 Jul 2007 Posts: 443 Location: Greenock

if the tournament were FIDE rated, would a players FIDE rating be taken into account when determining what section they are assigned to?

Daniel Rocks · Posted: Sun Jun 05, 2011 6:06 pm Post subject:

I need to wait to have confirmation from one of our experts whether it could be FIDE-rated. My initial feeling is that no it couldn't be, especially with 6 rounds. Also I think the fairest way would be to use CS ratings for groupings especially at congress time controls as it is the rating which people use far more regularly and gives a more accurate indication of their playing strength. Eg I have played 1 FIDE rated game in a year, I suspect other people are the same. Also, using start of season CS ratings avoids any quarrels and FIDE-ratings change every 2 months!.
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Daniel Rocks

Mike Scott · King Joined: 01 Feb 2007 Posts: 676 Location: Edinburgh

Sounds like a great idea - only poss. problem might be the date as it would clash with British as I think that finishes around the first weekend in Aug.

Though I guess from your post the venur is available only at that time?

Daniel Rocks · Posted: Sun Jun 05, 2011 6:51 pm Post subject:

Yes, only time unfortunately. Also I don't think the British clash is a big deal for the vast majority of Scottish congress goers. There are very few who venture to the British these days.
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Daniel Rocks

Alex McFarlane · King Joined: 13 Mar 2007 Posts: 413

Provided you satisfy the rating regulations there is nothing technically to stop such an event being FIDE rated. Only title norm events need to be 9 rounds.

However, if there are players over 2200 there must be a 4 hour session otherwise a 3 hour session suffices. If there is one session followed by a quickplay finish you must have 40 moves in the first session.

The major stumbling block is that FIDE charge an arm and a leg for all-play-all events. The actual fee varies with the average strength of the players in each event but, from memory, starts at €100 rather than the considerably more modest fees which apply for a Swiss.

If you want FIDE rating the only cost effective way to go is to hold a Swiss event.

Daniel Rocks · Posted: Sun Jun 05, 2011 7:58 pm Post subject:

Thanks for the information, Alex!

One small, probably stupid question? 100 euros per event? Would that cover the whole tournament or just 1 section. In light of this however the tournament will almost certainly solely be CS-rated. (Unless there was some dramatic entry which would allow for FIDE-rating).
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Daniel Rocks

AMcHarg · Posted: Sun Jun 05, 2011 8:06 pm Post subject:

Daniel Rocks · Posted: Sun Jun 05, 2011 8:10 pm Post subject:

100 euros to rate games of 6 people? No, too much of a rip off.
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Daniel Rocks

DMB · King Joined: 08 Mar 2007 Posts: 267

http://www.chessscotland.com/grading/fide_registration.htm

There's some notes for any event thinking of FIDE rating.

Daniel Rocks · Posted: Sun Jun 05, 2011 8:34 pm Post subject:

Thanks for the link Mr Bryson,

What is still unclear is whether or not the FIDE fees would affect the tournament overall or would affect each section. If we were to run the tournament as an umbrella with different sections, (eg Section A, B, C and so on) would each individual section incur an additional rating fee? Really unsure about this. If not, then I think it would be worth the 50 euro to rate the tournament as a whole. Would be very grateful if someone could clarify this.

Regards.
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Daniel Rocks

DMB · King Joined: 08 Mar 2007 Posts: 267

I dont know if an event consisting of multiple APAs would be levied at one standard fee for the event or for each section within the event. It's never been an issue I've considered before.

I suppose you could submit as a 24 player 5 round Swiss and restrict pairings to those within each group of 6. Whether FIDE would spot the dubious pairings, dont know.

A "proper" Swiss would be easier if you want definite answers on rating fee costs - as per the link given earlier.

Daniel Rocks · Posted: Sun Jun 05, 2011 10:42 pm Post subject:

Any idea on how to find out about FIDE grading fees regarding separate APAs under the umbrella of an overall tournament?
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Daniel Rocks

DMB · King Joined: 08 Mar 2007 Posts: 267

Sent an email and we'll see if can get an answer from FIDE on what the regulations mean.

Daniel Rocks · Posted: Tue Jun 07, 2011 1:16 pm Post subject:

It will be possible to have a 5 round FIDE-rated Open swiss over Saturday & Sunday. The catch is that we would need to exclude 2200+ FIDE rated players as there is a requirement for a minimum of 4hours per game at that rating. Looking at the statistics, there are only around 20 active players above that rating threshold and I could only see 2 or 3 of those max participating so I don't think it would be a huge loss to exclude them. How do others feel about this? Also, the entry fee would need to be raised a few £ to accommodate FIDE's fees. Feedback would be very helpful.
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Daniel Rocks